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Below are the most recent 25 friends' journal entries.
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| Tuesday, January 5th, 2010 |
equestrian
[ gryn ]
|
10:49p |
Art.. Again
Hate me or love me.. What ever. If anybody is interested in having a portrait drawn, let me know.  Just an example. More of my charcoal art can be found here: http://www.charcoalzen.com18"x24" = $500 12"x15" = $250 9"x12" = $100 Current Music: Empty Rooms Again by Jayne Sachs |
equestrian
[ ttfs ]
|
9:41p |
Blanketing for arthritis
Wondering what everyone's opinions are on blanketing the old guys and arthritis. My gelding (butterball in my icon - pic is 6 years old though) is coming 23 this year and, while he holds his weight pretty well, it does slip frighteningly fast anymore should he get wet / too cold. With the cold snap we're having, I have him in a Rambo mid-weight that I was only using for cold rain. He grows a great coat, but I suppose with his age and arthritis it's not working as well anymore. His turnout has a couple of trees, but no shelter and he does have an assigned stall in the barn if I want to keep him in. I prefer he goes out to walk around to keep moving for the joints although with hay in his rack, he'd likely never leave the stall. He's had the Rambo on for a few days now and I'm noticing that he's moving much better. He gets joint supplements and a Legend shot every few months, but I know his hips, hocks and neck have moderate arthritis and have for about 6 years. I know it's not a good idea to put a blanket on and then take it away, so he can keep it on as long as he's still happy with it (he's an angel to clothing thankfully). Anyone else find that blanketing the old ones regardless of coat helps the arthritis in winter? ( Pic of the old guy ) |
equestrian
[ wldhrsjen3 ]
|
9:39a |
is anyone familiar with Miller saddles?
So, my uncle is cleaning out his house and has decided to give me an old Eli Miller trail saddle. It was custom built years ago and given to him as commission for a job. I haven't seen photos but it's supposed to be in excellent shape; it's been kept inside and oiled regularly, though as far as I know no one has ridden in it for at least a decade. Eli Miller no longer makes saddles but a quick google search shows that his nephew (I believe it's a nephew) Henry has taken over. I'm just curious if anyone has any experience with these saddles. I probably won't be using this on my horses, but I'd kind of like to know more about what I'm getting... Would it be worth replacing the flocking and keeping it in riding-ready condition, or is this better as a collectible, do you think? |
| Sunday, January 3rd, 2010 |
equestrian
[ jules257 ]
|
10:54p |
|
equestrian
[ em_eye_are ]
|
7:28p |
Bulk shavings?
I posted a few months ago about stall bedding preferences (thanks for all the input!) and I now have a question regarding buying/finding bulk shavings. As mentioned previously, I am responsible for purchasing my own bedding at my boarding barn. I'm looking for suggestions, like a sawmill, where I can bag my own shavings in bulk. Currently, I am buying from the ranch supply store and it's not very economical. I don't have the ability to store a large pile of loose shavings, but do have room in the trailer tack room and a small corner of the barn, so having bulk shavings delivered is out of the question. I've used my best Google-Fu to find a place that would allow me to come and bag/load my own shavings and store them, but without much luck. Does anyone have suggestions for places to call or what/where to search? If it matters, I'm located in Littleton, Colorado. I don't mind driving a bit if it means I'm going to get a good deal (plus my friend also uses bagged shavings and we can split the gas). Thanks! |
equestrian
[ penella22 ]
|
3:35p |
Winter Trailering
So how many of you deal with winter trailering? In the past, my horse has been a backyard pwny, so trailering in the winter never happened and wasn't really missed either. But over the past year a few things have happened; 1.) My horse developed metabolic issues, which means it's very important to keep him in shape 2.) We made friends with a lady who has an indoor arena. :D So now I would really really *like* to trailer my gelding to the indoor on a semi-regular basis. Problem; I am a trailering noob and have not much of an idea of when it is safe to trailer during the winter. Can you really only safely do it when the roads are clear? We have a Valley stock trailer (2 horse step-up) and we tow it using an 8-cyl Toyota Forunner. I've driven our trailer with a horse in it exactly once. Which went fine! But it was on dry roads. Right now the 3 miles between my horse and the indoor is a pretty steep and slippery mess due to getting snow and then rain and then more snow. :/ I've realized that we don't have winter tires on our trailer, and that *studded* winter tires on the towing vehicle may be a good idea too. Not sure what else to do. I live in northern New England. Think 8 month winters and lots of snow. More trailer-savvy people out there? Help? |
| Saturday, January 2nd, 2010 |
equestrian
[ brigidsdaughter ]
|
4:35p |
Sizing Winter Boots
Because I'm crazy enough to go to my lesson in 13 degree weather, I'm seriously looking at a pair of winter boots, because...um...brrr. I've got my other layers figured out but my toes make me want to die every time if I forget to pick up some toe warmers. And I usually forget my toe warmers. I wear a size 9.5 in other Ariat boots...would I want a 9.5 in the winter boots, also, or a 10 for more wool sock goodness? Someone also said "oh, we don't bother with winter boots, we just throw on those rubber covers and it works fine" but does that actually work? Also, for those of you who are wondering what my lesson horse thought of working in the indoor when its 13 degrees? He thought that every cue to trot REALLY MEANT CANTER and every request to slow down really meant KEEP CANTERING. So, um, I don't think he minded much. I did, but he was all ears-pricked happy. Dorkface. |
equestrian
[ kudosirony ]
|
1:13p |
Saddles/Bits
Hey all! Three questions: 1. I'm looking for an English saddle, preferrably AP with a narrow to regular or regular tree, but dressage would be fine, too. Color isn't a big deal, nor is great condition - as long as the tree and billets are sound; I can even take care of reflocking. The thing is, I really don't want it to be too expensive - it would basically be used on the occasional horse I help train and as a training/get used to the feel saddle for my 2yr old STB. Once he does get started in training and fills out a bit to where he's going to be, I'll look for something better. My medium to wide stubben just doesn't work for him or the OTTB that I'm currently working with (but fits Cracker, the QH, like a dream!). 2. My Stubben needs some reflocking. Does anyone know of a good person in southwest OH (Dayton, to be exact, but I'm fine driving for a good person)? I've never had a saddle done before; about what cost range can I expect? 3. I've been reading different things, and I was wondering if some people could weigh in opinions on the type of bit they like to start youngsters with. For Fritz, I was thinking a D ring, but I'm torn between a simple doubt jointed, a french linked, and/or if I should get one with rubber mouth pieces. He's still a bit off from this point, but I like to plan things meticulously for when I do hit those stages. Current Music: Alkaline Trio - Radio | Powered by Last.fm |
equestrian
[ arglikeapirate ]
|
11:25a |
Cold weather
Brr! I'm sure everyone in these colder climates has really been... enjoying going out to the barn in this weather. I just got back from the morning feeding, and good lord I had completely forgotten how much frozen buckets suck-- not to mention it was too cold to ride! For me, that means 10-15 degrees F (-12 to -9C). I don't like to get my horse hot unless it's above that, and my instructor won't teach unless it's 18 (-7C) or warmer. We usually at least pull the horses out and handwalk or do inhand work, and my friends and I will pop on bareback and tool around. I know relatively, though, that's actually not that cold. Here in southeast Michigan we never see, for example, -40 degree weather! With that in mind, I was curious-- what do you guys consider weather in which it's too cold to ride? And when it is, what do you do instead? |
equestrian
[ heytherestephy ]
|
1:17a |
Photos!
Just dropping in to say nothing catastrophic has happened in the last week with my ponies LOL. Mylie's swelling has gone, No one is freezing, I've found a farrier who trims Drafts and Draft X's who is flexible and willing to work with a sedated horse. Woohoo for me. ( So I think I'd bring you guys a little new year cheer ) |
| Friday, January 1st, 2010 |
equestrian
[ lurath ]
|
5:44p |
Blanket advice and recommendations for a "special" horse?
I was wondering if anyone else has tried TurtleNeck Turnout Rugs. The testimonials on the site are good, but I've never known anyone personally that has owned or used one. I want someone to comfort me and tell me that this brand (or another brand that you've had success with) will fit her before I dump money on a new heavy weight rug. My horse needs a new better-fitting blanket after having me realize that her current blankets do not fit her well enough for her to wear 23-7, which is what she needs to do right now. In particular she is getting very bad shoulder rubs, as well as rubbing and some soreness along her withers and upper shoulder-neck junction from the blanket. It's not awful, but it is obviously not ideal either. ( More background on our issue/story and a picture of the hard-to-fit beastie. )Happy New Year from Deli and I! |
| Thursday, December 31st, 2009 |
equestrian
[ hoodsey ]
|
10:41p |
|
equestrian
[ regentlion ]
|
8:00p |
Why DON'T you wear a helmet?
Because DH and I are hanging out here tonight and not doing anything 'fun', I thought I'd post a question I've been meaning to ask for a long time. READ THE ENTIRE POST BEFORE YOU RESPOND: If you don't wear a helmet, why do you choose not to? I think we all know that wearing a helmet is a really good idea. So is not smoking, wearing a seatbelt, not running with scissors, avoiding hot objects, ETC. I think we all know how fragile the brain is and how unpredictable horses are. I think we all know that adults are free to make their own decisions, weigh the benefits and risks, and decide what to do accordingly. If an adult chooses not to wear a helmet or a seatbelt, or to smoke, or run with scissors, or whatever, I personally don't care. It is their decision. They know the risks and have decided to do what they feel comfortable doing. I'm just trying to understand what MOTIVATES a person to not wear a helmet... comfort? Aesthetics? I especially wonder because I grew up wearing a helmet "every time every ride" and then when I started to ride in a certain discipline, quit for about 2 years. I did not wear a helmet, every time, every ride. I don't know why I stopped doing it. It was certainly convenient! It was certainly nice not to have helmet head! But I was (internally) uncomfortable with it and so started to wear a helmet again. I'm back in a jumping discipline and now am wearing one "every time every ride" again. I KNOW first hand that helmet wearing is smart. I also know FIRST HAND that when I was blithely going along without my helmet, and showing without a helmet (hunt cap!), my mom was on my case to WEAR MY HELMET. Her being on my case didn't change a thing. So... I KNOW that one person nagging another person isn't going to change their mind. So please. If you reply to this thread, be respectful of other people's decisions. NO need to beat the dead horse that wearing a hat is beneficial. We all know. Use this as an opportunity to understand "the other side."If you don't feel comfortable replying to this thread and can explain to me why you don't wear a helmet (so that I can try to understand why I didn't), please feel free to email me at RegentLion@yahoo.com. You wont find ridicule, I promise. |
equestrian
[ farmorespel ]
|
4:51p |
Breyer Horses For Sale
~Mods, please tell me if this is not allowed, and I'll move it.~ Anyway, I've been remodeling my room, and now that it's FINALLY DONE, I'm getting rid of extra stuff that I do not need. A majority of this includes my 'old' Breyer Horses. Pictures/Prices Below:  LEFT TO RIGHT: Snowman (I think): $30.00 (obo) He's in very nice condition, with little -to no- scuffing. Anatomy in Motion: $45.00 She's in very nice condition, with no paint chipping, or scuff marks. Great for teaching the anatomy of a horse for Pony Club or Stable Management, or just for collecting. Buckskin Cattle Horse: $25-30.00 In good condition, but with a little rubbing along the edges of the hooves and ears. Paint Mare: $25.00 In good condition, with rubbing along sides of barrel and end of tail. Dun American Gldng: $25.00 In okay condition, with rubbing along ears and hooves, with some black spotting on color. Otherwise, condition is good.  LEFT TO RIGHT Commander Riker: $35.00 In great conditon, with little rubbing or scuff markes. Miss Resistance Free: $25.00 In okay condition, has rubbing along ears and hooves. Grey Andalusian Stallion: $50.00 ($45.00 and up firm) In excellent condition with no rubbing or scuff marks. Has been taken very good care of. Chestnut Morgan/Arab Stallion: $35.00 In good conditon, with a slight rub on right nostril and hooves.  LEFT TO RIGHT Black Andalusian: $25.00 In okay condition, with rubs on face, hooves and barrels. Smarty Jones: $20.00 In good condition, but is missing stand. Otherwise, he's a nice model. Party Shoes: $20.00 In good condition with a little scuffing. MORE PICTURES ARE AVAIABLE ON REQUEST. BREYERS KEPT IN A SMOKE-FREE ENVIORNMENT. IF INTERESTED, COMMENT AND/OR EMAIL ME AY oh3day@hotmail.com. Feel free to ask questions. All prices OBO unless otherwise stated. Thanks for looking~ -FS Current Music: Burn Notice |
equestrian
[ mck3nz13s ]
|
1:22p |
Accident prone and bum legged horse
I have only lurked here for a few days, but I feel the need to post (and I haven't came across any topic similar to this). My mare is very accident-prone and clumsy, she is always getting into the wrong things at the wrong times. Somehow she managed to get an infection in her left front leg, making her leg look more like a stump than a leg. She has had this ongoing issue for about 10-11 weeks now and I am at a loss of what to do. The swelling went down around week 8-9 but has not gone away completely. She is still swollen in her knee and cannon bone. To add on to our problem... ( continue if interested ) Current Mood:  frustrated |
equestrian
[ penella22 ]
|
12:00p |
Rump rugs and winter riding
I've never ridden in the winter enough to buy one of these before, but they seem like a good thing to have around this winter so I'm planning on buying one soon. I've looked around and seen some waterproof ones, some wool ones, some that go under the saddle, some that attach to the back and one with weighted corners. Hmm. I'm just not familiar enough with all the various rump rug incarnations to know what I'm looking for. When would you use wool instead of a waterproof rump rug? When would you want one that goes under the saddle? I will be mainly riding in our deep-in-snow-but-at-least-it's-level riding ring for about half an hour at a time, an hour at most. However, I will also be trailering to an indoor for lessons once or twice a month, which will involve more intensive riding at something other than a walk. Since my horse is a Curly and is free to go outside 24/7, I do not plan on clipping him. So...recommendations on rump rugs? Please post links! Thanks! Current Mood:  cheerfulCurrent Music: Bright Eyes--I'm Wide Awake It's Morning |
| Wednesday, December 30th, 2009 |
equestrian
[ jnlldxn ]
|
11:01p |
I don't have a horse. I lurk here often. Had them as pets when I was a kid. Now i just like to paint them. However, I wasz wondering what everyones thoughts were on the wild mustang roundup. Personally, I am not a huge advocate of animal rights. But, this is one of the few times I have to agree with them. There alot going on inlvolving the grazing land, and the government mismanaging the horses. basically they are removing them and cramming them into large corals for the rest of their lives. I think there was something mentioned about some of them being hauled off to 'ranches' too. But, I have a generally idea of what is really happening with these animals. For those of you that don't know what is going on, you can find it on the cloud foundation website. Also we get to pay for it with our tax money. http://www.thecloudfoundation.org/ |
equestrian
[ princessklutz04 ]
|
11:14p |
Hey everyone!! Just thought I'd give you a little update from my earlier post. We moved my mare about a week before Christmas to my trainer's barn. It turned out to be a very special opportunity, and we had to go build her a stall and prepare everything. I'm now working with my trainer daily and gaining absolutely invaluable knowledge from all of her Grand Prix experience, getting training on my horse, and riding her Grand Prix horses. It turned out to be a work for board/total immersion training deal. I'm definitely getting far more than I'm "paying" for, and I can never thank my trainer enough for what she is doing for me right now. As for Breeze, she's living the life. My trainer absolutely adores her to bits, so Breeze gets attention constantly. I was a little concerned that she'd be stressed going from being outside 24/7 to being inside most of the time, with 6-8 hours of turnout, but she could NOT be happier. She trailed like a dream horse despite it being pouring rain and a stock trailer (we were going less than 5 miles up the road), was a little spooky coming off, but since then has been a rock star. She has put on almost 50lbs and absolutely snapped out of her depression. She's talkative, engaged, playful, and just all around a completely different horse. And the bonus? Instead of arguing with me about blankets, my trainer thought Breeze's might be a little thin, so she added an extra liner (of her own!) underneath until we could buy a medium weight. I love that woman!! My trainer also has several breedings to a Holsteiner stallion named Roller Coaster, so if all goes as planned my mare will get trailered down to Peterson and Smith where they're keeping his semen and get bred in the Spring. So exciting! Thanks to everyone for your supportive comments on my last post. Sometimes it's nice to hear from other horse folks that you're not crazy. I'll post some pics of Breeze and the other horses in a few days. Current Mood: cheerful |
equestrian
[ emptyvanity ]
|
10:26a |
New Year Goals!
(Mods, I searched back a few pages and found nothing, but feel free to yell at me if this has been done :P ) With 2010 at our doorstep and show season a few short months away, my barn has been busy talking about our goals and plans for the winter training season and beyond. So, what are your pony plans for the winter? What are your goals for 2010? Here's what I have to start things off: WINTER = -First and foremost, get Cholula's canter down. I want to be solid TL coming out of winter. We've made leaps and bounds in progress in the past few rides on this, so I'm pretty confident it'll happen. -Keep things interesting! We do some lateral work now, but I've recently run into the problem of: if she's forward and we don't have to drill the basics and things that I'm used to having to work on...now what? I'd like to get people together every so often and do some fun "games," quadrille things, etc. Keep us entertained, keep the horses entertained, learn stuff. Try to forget about how cold it is. -Ride Zeus at least once per week! My problem child needs to be kept moving, no matter what I decide about his retirement status. SPRING/SUMMER: -Make it to my first recognized show at TL! Due to costs I think I'll only do one show this year, but depending on where I am financially I may be able to do more than that. We shall see :) A more recent pic of Cho being ridden under the cut. And by more recent I mean it was March. ( Read more... ) |
| Tuesday, December 29th, 2009 |
equestrian
[ eyelikerancid ]
|
10:21p |
US Army Caisson Platoon, Therapeutic Riding
The US Army's Caisson Platoon at Fort Myer, Virginia has a therapuetic riding program for injured soldiers and veterans. The Caisson horses are the ones you see photos of at Arlington National Cemetary, pulling the caskets. The article I'm sharing is particularly important to me, because the Army veterinarian they feature, CPT Mariah Kochavi, was one of the first vets I worked with at my first duty station (I'm an army vet tech). She passed away a few days ago due to complications from a massive stroke she had last year. Here is the article: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/12/24/AR2009122402896.html?sid=ST2009122500015(you may have to create a log in; I logged in with my facebook account) Anyway, being a soldier myself, I'm very happy that the Army recognizes the importance of horses in therapy. At my current duty station (Fort Sill, OK) we have 12 government horses that comprise a field artillery half section. I've spent time volunteering at a small local therapeutic riding facility, and the woman who runs it would like to join forces with the half section with the ultimate goal of creating something like the program at Fort Myer. I'd like to assist; I've recently become more or less the manager of the on-post veterinary clinic (the NCOIC, for any of you familar with the Army :) so I have a working relationship with the half section soldiers and horses all ready established. I've all ready given them quite a bit of newspaper articles on the subject, I was planning on trying to set up a meeting with the man who runs the half section (he's a civilian), Jean (the BO of the therapeutic riding stable) and myself to discuss it. But, being a (relatively) young female in the Army, having "crazy" ideas sometimes makes it difficult to be taken seriously so any suggestions are appreciated. A brief summary: How do I broach the subject of startig a therapeutic riding program with old fashioned army guys? |
equestrian
[ gypsydrifting ]
|
12:49p |
Working Student?
For the past month or so I have been interested in doing a working student position. I recently started riding lessons at a barn about 43 minutes from my house, and I love it. They're really great and I feel like I'm learning a lot and making a lot of progress. However, my lessons are only twice a week and the more time I spend with them (and with my recent lack of visits to see my special boy on the weekends) the more I start going stir crazy every other day of the week. I've also been pretty hell-bent (although hell-bent is a very benign term for it) on becoming a trainer somday, and although I have a pretty decent amount of experience with horses on the ground I would like the oppurtunity to get even more experience with them, and start getting some experience with training horses. Knowing this, a friend of mine recommended I look into working student positions. I've already looked at a few barns. The barn where I take lessons does have a working student program and it sounds like a good option ($5 per hour put towards a lesson, so if I put in twelve hours of working around the barn I'd get enough money for a private lesson), but I can only work on days were my instructor is there. I also can't work that hour if someone else is already working it (for some strange reason). Scheduling wise it's not exactly ideal as I'd still be going stir crazy and that's the exact opposite of what I want. There's another barn I've looked into that I really love, but in regards to working for them.. it's been going rather slowly. I was talking with the manager through e-mail at the beginning of the month, but stopped hearing from her. A friend of mine is a lesson student there and said it takes them forever to respond to e-mails, so not to worry too much, but this is just getting ridiculous. I gave them a call today, but I'm not holding my breath for a response any more. Now I come to the problem of not knowing where else to go to look into this sort of thing. I've already looked at sites like yardandgroom.com and gotten little to no response on any available jobs there. I've tried finding barns that at least have a page on their website that talks about a working student program, but my problem comes with not yet having a license (I wouldn't have a car to drive anywhere if I had my license, anyways) and needing someone to drive me to work, and I'm already taking lessons at seven o' clock because of transportation issues during the day. I need places relatively close to my house and have only been able to find one so far (the barn that stopped responding to my e-mail). I feel kind of at a loss. So I was wondering if anyone knew of any places offering working student positions in the Boston area (about thirty minutes or so out). I've also had people tell me about internships (the whole travel-to-another-state kind of deal), and although I'm nowhere near ready for that now, I don't think, maybe any recommendations on what to look at for a later time? Any tips or recommendations would be very much appreciated. I've already gotten some great advice from looking at previous posts on this subject, but, again, I still feel at a loss as to where to go to find a job like this. Thanks in advance for any help! (: Current Mood:  pessimisticCurrent Music: Bon Jovi - We Weren't Born To Follow |
equestrian
[ mirrorofagirl ]
|
10:28a |
Ugh, Rain Rot Question...
After 3 years of no rain, we got all 3 years worth at one time here in Georgia. It's been awful, the fertilizer has run into the lake I'm sure, the best pastures at the barn are muddy, and the horses are popping up with rain rot right left and sideways. So does anyone have a "magical" cure for rain rot? Bathing isn't much of an option most days because our wash stall is outside and its raining and/or freezing cold most days, so I need something I can put on and leave on. I've gotten a lot of advice but I'd like to see what's worked for everyone else. I've always used MTG, but I'm looking for something more cost effective since I have to treat at least 6 of my herd, and I'm sure more will pop up with it if the rain doesn't let up. Aside from the cost factor, MTG literally makes me gag when I use it, so I'm not looking forward to spending an hour or two a day covered in the goop while I treat everyone. Thanks in advance! Current Mood:  tired |
| Monday, December 28th, 2009 |
equestrian
[ serennig ]
|
10:41p |
Horse Hauling Recommendations Ontario <--> Prairies
I'm looking for any recommendations for good horse haulers for the mid-Canada corridor. GTA to somewhere mid-prairies. We've got names of places and some quotes, but I'd feel better if I heard someone, anyone, say they'd used a place before and liked them. Or didn't like them, and why, so we can strike them off the list. I know there's probably very few people out of the large population reading this who have ever had a horse transported along that route, or even know someone who has, but of those very few, I'd appreciate any input. :) |
equestrian
[ piedwick ]
|
4:28p |
Horse Boarding Possibly Needed...
Hello all, This past weekend I came across a unsettling and quite dangerous situation at the farm I board my pregnant mare at. I brought it to my barn owners attention and I hope he will fix the situation but if not I will have to move my mare to another barn for her own safety and for my peace of mind. She is currently boarded at a farm in near Harford County. I'd like to find a place in or near the Baltimore County or Harford County to board her at but will take on more options. Like I said she is pregnant and should be due around May/June 2010. She is a easy keeper, isn't a cribber or biter, she's a sweet little horse (13.3 hands rocky mountain / paso fino mix we believe). I just want her to be kept in a safe environment with good fencing. I'm looking for a place that offers full care or at least supplies hay and free feeds hay 24/7 for turned out horses. Supplied grain would be nice too, but not necessary. If anyone knows of a farm that is willing to take in a pregnant mare who will have a foal in the next few months in or around the Baltimore area, PLEASE contact me. Allison |
equestrian
[ vesleskjor ]
|
2:52p |
Morrisville equine program experiences?
I've been doing the whole "WHAT DO I WANT TO DO WITH MY LIFE?!" thing lately and I've tentatively entertained the idea of entering an equine degree program. Luckily, I don't live too far from SUNY Morrisville. But, the thing is, I've known various people who've attended there, some for the equine program and some not, and I hear mixed reactions about the course. One of the trainers at my barn who's not that much older than me graduated from it and one of the other trainers said it's gone downhill a little since she was there... But getting to the point of my post: Have any of you done the Equine Science and Management program at Morrisville, even if you didn't graduate from it? Do you think it was worth the time and money? Or should I just hang around my trainer for a few more years and just learn that way? lol |
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